Help ! No timing mark on the balancer, just the scale shown with no other marks ??

[WhiteGP]

I'm assuming this is a 68 - 69 440 since it came with the 4429s carb ( which is 68 year ) There is NO timing mark on the harmonic balancer, just the scale shown with no indications of TDC or 0 or nothing Anyone have info ?? Do I need to go to the B Body site ?

I should add that I made a small tick mark with a dab of white paint on the 2nd larger indent and it did show up in my timing light, ( since removed because it was wrong ) so I'm in the ballpark, I just dont have a clue what the scale is here

THANKS

 

[Deathproofcuda]

I'd guess that is an aftermarket balancer. You can make or buy and piston stop to confirm where TDC is.

The line that goes all the way across the balancer edge in your photo is probably TDC. The lines that go 3/4 of the way across are probably 10-degree increments (should be spaced about 5/8 of an inch apart from one another). Shortest lines are probably 2-degree increments.

 

[WhiteGP]

I'd guess that is an aftermarket balancer. You can make or buy and piston stop to confirm where TDC is.

The line that goes all the way across the balancer edge in your photo is probably TDC. The lines that go 3/4 of the way across are probably 10-degree increments (should be spaced about 5/8 of an inch apart from one another). Shortest lines are probably 2-degree increments.

Thanks !!! So the one of the two solid marks are TDC possibly, this makes sense, I did not consider that this might be an aftermarket balancer., i will work on this premise and work it out

Yea, good advice on the piston stop, might have to go that route or make one like you say, This is irritating me so i need verification...I've had the car for 2 months and Summit Racing and Classic Industries have exhausted my discretionary dollars ... the wife is looking at me cross eyed like she did when I had my V code car in 86-89

Thanks for the input !!!

 

[pschlosser]

If the engine runs pretty decent, and you trust the distributor timing, when the rotor is approaching cylinder #1 spark plug wire on the distributor cap, you will be close to TDC on the gauge at the crankshaft balancer, near the timing mark.

If you can find the TDC mark, or the 0-degree timing mark, but it looks similar to most of the others on the balancer, you can use some nail polish or similar to mark it, and later when using the timing light, you can better see where the TDC mark falls.

 

[WhiteGP]

If the engine runs pretty decent, and you trust the distributor timing, when the rotor is approaching cylinder #1 spark plug wire on the distributor cap, you will be close to TDC on the gauge at the crankshaft balancer, near the timing mark.

If you can find the TDC mark, or the 0-degree timing mark, but it looks similar to most of the others on the balancer, you can use some nail polish or similar to mark it, and later when using the timing light, you can better see where the TDC mark falls.

Yes , I put a mark on the 2nd larger indent and got it in the timing light, need to work out which indent is TDC, I think I was withing 5 degrees of TDC pulling the cap, as always thanks pschlosser !! Like the Pink Floyd Album "Wish you were here " Y'all are leading me the solution

 

[Chryco Psycho]

I have not used a timing light since the 70s
hold the throttle at about 2500 rpm with a fast idle screw , advance the timing until the rpm quits rising then back off a couple of degrees until the RPM just starts to drop & tighten it up

 

[MoparCarGuy]

I added the most likely markings for your balancer as I agree with @Deathproofcuda.
You should be attempting to get 16-18° BTDC with 32-34° Total Timing. Your balancer will allow you to see total timing when you rev it up to 3000 RPM or so.
You may see more total timing than needed if your distributor is not limited for mechanical advance.

 

[Deathproofcuda]

Nice work @MoparCarGuy !

Way to go above and beyond!

 

[Xcudame]

I have to agree here with Chryco Psycho. I've been tuning my 70 Challenger for years with nothing but a vacuum gauge and Sears tachometer! Vacuum gauge for carburator tuning and RPM for timing! That's the way my dad taught me many years ago!

 

[Chryco Psycho]

I had a friend challenge me , he told me " No way you can be accurate " so I set the timing , he checked with a light & changed the timing , I set it right back to the same # twice .
The way I do it the engine determines what it wants not what some book tells you to set it , the only reason to use a light is to reset once you know where the engine like to be .

 

[MoparCarGuy]

@WhiteGP

Does your timing cover (welded-on tab) look like this? 440Source shows this info for that style.

"Part number 4100436, used in 1978 and 79 on trucks and vans with 440's. This has a unique "tube" that bolts onto the timing tab. The before TDC side goes all the way to 30 degrees, marked in 2 degree increments."

The tube may or may not be present.

 

[WhiteGP]

@WhiteGP

Does your timing cover (welded-on tab) look like this? 440Source shows this info for that style.

"Part number 4100436, used in 1978 and 79 on trucks and vans with 440's. This has a unique "tube" that bolts onto the timing tab. The before TDC side goes all the way to 30 degrees, marked in 2 degree increments."

The tube may or may not be present.
View attachment 127262

@WhiteGP

Does your timing cover (welded-on tab) look like this? 440Source shows this info for that style.

"Part number 4100436, used in 1978 and 79 on trucks and vans with 440's. This has a unique "tube" that bolts onto the timing tab. The before TDC side goes all the way to 30 degrees, marked in 2 degree increments."

The tube may or may not be present.
View attachment 127262

YES ! it does look like this and yes, the tube is gone, soooo I now know where the harmonic balancer and timing cover are from, I need to verify the engine date now, I'm gonna be very unhappy if its a 78-79 BUT since it had the 4429s carb i'm still thinking its a 68-69

The scale with the missing tube is marked at 14 degrees

Thanks to ALL OF YOU for the great information, I owe you all a COLD BEER !

 

[WhiteGP]

I added the most likely markings for your balancer as I agree with @Deathproofcuda.
You should be attempting to get 16-18° BTDC with 32-34° Total Timing. Your balancer will allow you to see total timing when you rev it up to 3000 RPM or so.
You may see more total timing than needed if your distributor is not limited for mechanical advance.

View attachment 127261

Thank You Thank You Thank You !!!!!

 

[WhiteGP]

I added the most likely markings for your balancer as I agree with @Deathproofcuda.
You should be attempting to get 16-18° BTDC with 32-34° Total Timing. Your balancer will allow you to see total timing when you rev it up to 3000 RPM or so.
You may see more total timing than needed if your distributor is not limited for mechanical advance.

View attachment 127261

Thank you so much, This makes perfect sense !!

 

[WhiteGP]

I have to agree here with Chryco Psycho. I've been tuning my 70 Challenger for years with nothing but a vacuum gauge and Sears tachometer! Vacuum gauge for carburator tuning and RPM for timing! That's the way my dad taught me many years ago!

Thank you sir !

 

[WhiteGP]

I have not used a timing light since the 70s
hold the throttle at about 2500 rpm with a fast idle screw , advance the timing until the rpm quits rising then back off a couple of degrees until the RPM just starts to drop & tighten it up

I'll try this first thing today, THANKS !

 

[Ricks72Chlgr440]

I have an aftermarket balancer with similar markings. The long mark is a 90* indication for those who need to rotate their engines 90* at a time to adjust the valves.

 

[WhiteGP]

I have an aftermarket balancer with similar markings. The long mark is a 90* indication for those who need to rotate their engines 90* at a time to adjust the valves.

Are you saying the bottom mark is not TDC ? There is only this one scale with 2 long marks, from one long mark to the 2nd does not look like 90 degrees ( 1/4 way around the circumference )

 

[Ricks72Chlgr440]

Are you saying the bottom mark is not TDC ? There is only this one scale with 2 long marks, from one long mark to the 2nd does not look like 90 degrees ( 1/4 way around the circumference )

The fact that one complete revolution of the balancer is 360*, a long hash mark at 1/4 of the circumference would be 90*. On your balancer, the long hash mark closest to the smaller hash marks is likely your TDC mark.

 

[Xcudame]

Top of the block on the driver's side is a pad with the engine size and year. B is 66, C is 67, etc. Photo is a 70 413 industrial. "F" is 1970.