Rear valance hardware question

[Gary Kitchens]

I took this apart seven years ago and I did not notice this. Two of the quarter 20 bolts dealing with the rear valance and bumper have copper washers and this is confusing. There’s only two out of the set and I don’t know their exact placement.

They have the grip tight fingers underneath the washers. But not the swirl grip of the other quarter 20 screws that I have for that panel. Everything went into the same bucket seven years ago when I did the lower valance. And I brought them out of the same bucket to clean and restore them and reassemble the rear valance, but I want to get these in the right spot cause this is a 90% concourse restoration.

 

[Gary Kitchens]

I took this apart seven years ago and I did not notice this. Two of the quarter 20 bolts dealing with the rear valance and bumper have copper washers and this is confusing. There’s only two out of the set and I don’t know their exact placement.

They have the grip tight fingers underneath the washers. But not the swirl grip of the other quarter 20 screws that I have for that panel. Everything went into the same bucket seven years ago when I did the lower valance. And I brought them out of the same bucket to clean and restore them and reassemble the rear valance, but I want to get these in the right spot cause this is a 90% concourse restoration.

View attachment 140305

View attachment 140306

Here’s a picture of the full set that came out of the bucket that was not molested after it was removed from the car and I cannot count for the four screws With the built-in washer, nor can I account for the other seven screws three of which have the rubber glue on them to prevent them from allowing water in. I must’ve been in a hurry that day, and I didn’t take enough photos during the removal.

 

[pschlosser]

What I share may be applicable to only the 1970-72 model years. Subject to my mis-remembering.

I believe the (set of) fasteners for the rear valence can vary slightly through the production year, from differing plants. Sometimes there are bolts used where studs are also found, or Phillips pan head vs hex head SEMS bolts. I understand if they ran out of something, they may make a temporary substitution to keep the assembly line moving.

unless you polished the [pictured] SEMS bolts (SEMS = built-in washer) with teeth, that color seems too light to be copper, it should be plenty oxidized, and if it were pure copper (think how soft 10-14 gauge solid copper wire is) those teeth would disappear once torqued.

That said, it IS a curious oddity why there is a "gold-looking" finish on the washer element of the black iron-phosphate OEM finish.

The 1/4-20 x 5/8 SEMS bolt(s) with teeth, I believe there are four (4) of those, at least for a 1970 Barracuda. But things may vary.

In the set of fasteners shown by post #2, in a typical fastener set for the rear lower valance, I normally see for (4) U-nuts, four (4) 1/4-20 studs, and four (4) Conical KEPS nuts. Those two KEPS nuts with the smaller diameter washer look like the correct ones.

The six (6) #10-24 x 5/8 SEMS bolts with thread point look very much like the two (2) I often find screwed through the bottom of the valance to the mounting bracket.

What I don't see are the two (2) #10-24 x 5/8 Phillips Pan Head SEMD bolts with self-tapping point.

Finally, if you're pretty sure you did NOT have U-nuts on the rear valance panel, then you likely did not have studs, either.

 

[moparlee]

The only bolts that I know of that had that copper grip washer were the two for the voltage regulator.

 

[Challenger RTA]

1972-74 Dodge Challenger Rear Valance Bolt​

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New reproduction valance bolt kit for a 1972-74 Challenger. We strive to be perfect, but we are human and mistakes happen, but we will take care of them.

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[Gary Kitchens]

What I share may be applicable to only the 1970-72 model years. Subject to my mis-remembering.

I believe the (set of) fasteners for the rear valence can vary slightly through the production year, from differing plants. Sometimes there are bolts used where studs are also found, or Phillips pan head vs hex head SEMS bolts. I understand if they ran out of something, they may make a temporary substitution to keep the assembly line moving.

unless you polished the [pictured] SEMS bolts (SEMS = built-in washer) with teeth, that color seems too light to be copper, it should be plenty oxidized, and if it were pure copper (think how soft 10-14 gauge solid copper wire is) those teeth would disappear once torqued.

That said, it IS a curious oddity why there is a "gold-looking" finish on the washer element of the black iron-phosphate OEM finish.

The 1/4-20 x 5/8 SEMS bolt(s) with teeth, I believe there are four (4) of those, at least for a 1970 Barracuda. But things may vary.

In the set of fasteners shown by post #2, in a typical fastener set for the rear lower valance, I normally see for (4) U-nuts, four (4) 1/4-20 studs, and four (4) Conical KEPS nuts. Those two KEPS nuts with the smaller diameter washer look like the correct ones.

The six (6) #10-24 x 5/8 SEMS bolts with thread point look very much like the two (2) I often find screwed through the bottom of the valance to the mounting bracket.

What I don't see are the two (2) #10-24 x 5/8 Phillips Pan Head SEMD bolts with self-tapping point.

Finally, if you're pretty sure you did NOT have U-nuts on the rear valance panel, then you likely did not have studs, either.

It is a copper looking color and yes, I wire wheel them to clean them up prior to repainting so I’m not gonna anodize these balls and I’m not gonna put them through the chemical process when it’s not technically necessary but yes, they have the 4 to 6 fingers around the lip of the steel washer that is definitely played in copper. I don’t understand why but I’m gonna pay more attention to this message tomorrow I just finished four hours of cooking for a bunch of people and I’m having a drink and I will open this up tomorrow morning and reply to you properly

 

[Gary Kitchens]

It is a copper looking color and yes, I wire wheel them to clean them up prior to repainting so I’m not gonna anodize these balls and I’m not gonna put them through the chemical process when it’s not technically necessary but yes, they have the 4 to 6 fingers around the lip of the steel washer that is definitely played in copper. I don’t understand why but I’m gonna pay more attention to this message tomorrow I just finished four hours of cooking for a bunch of people and I’m having a drink and I will open this up tomorrow morning and reply to you properly

I don’t know why it quotes every time I hit reply I didn’t mean to, but every single one of the six screws you see their quarter 20 but they are self tappers and I think that’s because the factory balance didn’t have the screw holes in the rear pan because they fitted them to the three side bolts two center studs prior to stringing them in to the rear pan underneath the Tail panel

 

[Gary Kitchens]

I just realized that I have the fuel tank hardware in this bucket the filler neck hold down hardware so I’ll be taking that step here in a moment and collating everything together and then I’ll just put these damn shiny copper coated sample bolts somewhere where they match per Side and use the rest to fill in the difference