• Welcome to For E Bodies Only !

    We are a community of Plymouth Cuda and Dodge Challenger owners. Join now! Its Free!

Barracuda - Odd engine stamp - Not matching # / Original.. or?

Chryslerdude

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2017
Messages
76
Reaction score
50
Location
North Sealand - Denmark
Hello E-Buddies!

I hope to hear some advise, as to what I can truthfully inform potential buyers of my 1970 Barracuda Gran Coupé, regarding the originality of the engine!

I really hate to sell it, as it is such a beautiful (and healthy) car, which has given me SO much driving pleasure the last two seasons, but having bought a 1971 FE5 Barracuda vert project, everything besides my Mopar love, sort of dictates selling this beautiful 1970 (also FE5) hardtop! (Including, of course the wife.. who thinks "it's best", and tells me this often.. 🤨 )

IMG_6180.jpg


It has been my perception all along, that the engine is original to the car, as everything about the car suggests that it is.. (ALL engine bay parts, seemed to be the original "Moparts", and the car just seems untouched, (apart from a full respray from Citron mist gold metallic, to FE5!), but to my disappointment, there was no visible matching sequence number on the lower part of the block by the oil pan, but just these stampings on the upper part (passenger side, by the water pump housing), reading from top to bottom:

"F383", and below that, "22", and perhaps, below that (half hidden under a bolt), I think there's an "R"!

Thus, my plans to present clear proof in form of matching sequence numbers, are now reduced to "perhaps establish credibility", that this engine being coriginal to the car. Although I have read some information about odd Mopar engine stampings, my knowledge is way to limited here, so I hope to learn from some of you experts! Perhaps worth mentioning, is that the car is relatively early.. produced in october 1969!

Besides this might be effecting the sale price, I feel that it is also very important for the next "caretaker" of the car, to know as much as possible, about it's heritage and originality, so any info in this regard, will be much apreaciated -

Thank you in advance, all commenting on this post!

(Check this Google photo link, for pics!)
 
Last edited:

Xcudame

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 27, 2023
Messages
1,047
Reaction score
753
Location
Southeast Arizona
The F383 is definitely a 70 383. How about casting date(s) on the side of the block? Also, could you post picture of the passenger side of the block where the number should be? Might be able to tell if the numbers either got ground off or were never stamped (strange things happened at the plants back then!). Also a picture of the fender tag and/or broadcast sheet would be very helpful.
I for one aplode your effect to be honest and straightforward about the car. Sure is a beautiful Gran Coupe. I'd hate to part with it. Would look great having a 70 FE5 coupe next to a 71 FE5 convertible side by side in the garage! But I know it's your choice.
 

Chryslerdude

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2017
Messages
76
Reaction score
50
Location
North Sealand - Denmark
The F383 is definitely a 70 383. How about casting date(s) on the side of the block? Also, could you post picture of the passenger side of the block where the number should be? Might be able to tell if the numbers either got ground off or were never stamped (strange things happened at the plants back then!). Also a picture of the fender tag and/or broadcast sheet would be very helpful.
I for one aplode your effect to be honest and straightforward about the car. Sure is a beautiful Gran Coupe. I'd hate to part with it. Would look great having a 70 FE5 coupe next to a 71 FE5 convertible side by side in the garage! But I know it's your choice.

Thank you very much... After reading a few more half hours, I realize, that I might have been looking in a slightly wrong location.. so I will arrange a trip to the garage and get the Barracuda up on the lift, armed with "light, camera, action" (and brake cleaner).. I remember asking my friend, who did the exhaust, if he looked for the number, and now.. he is not sure if it was this, or another car.. so, suddenly, theres hope again! Thanks guys !! And yes, keeping it, would be optimal.. but I am not sure, that my economy agrees.. and I already work WAY to much... 😅 - Will post pic's when I get there.. but the weather forecast here the coming week, is not exactly "Barracuda worthy".. 😒

Thnx again ! 🥰
 

pschlosser

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2022
Messages
549
Reaction score
181
Location
Santa Rosa, California
Not every block gets a VIN. I've heard this reported more than once. I can't say I've looked on every block I've come across, but when I looked, it's always been there.

The stamped number on the block can be hidden behind engine paint. You're looking for a flat machined area just above or touching the oil pan rail. On the passenger side. It's about 2-inches long and 1/2-inch high. The surface faces outward, perpendicular to the ground.

If you don't see a flat machined area, in the middle of the oil pan, on the passenger side, adjacent to and/or touching the oil pan, I don't think you want to bother removing any paint.

If your engine is missing it's VIN number, I may just call it original, but without documented proof. I'm not sure anyone will really care. This isn't one of those ultra rare Hemicudas. She sure is pretty, though.

Two images, one with VIN one without.

1691536475073.jpeg


1691536510330.jpeg


There is a partial VIN on the transmission, too.
 
Last edited:

pschlosser

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2022
Messages
549
Reaction score
181
Location
Santa Rosa, California
I, too, have owned some pretty nice E-bodies. And I always held on to the one that was had the biggest engine or was potentially the most valuable, but not necessarily the prettiest.

Only once did I own a convertible, and it was in pretty bad shape. But boy, do I still miss that 318-2 car. I miss driving with the top down, southern California coast highway on a Saturday morning with clear skies and white puffy clouds. Good times. But on cold or rainy nights, I longed for a hard top.

I support your hanging on to the convertible.
 

moparlee

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2011
Messages
2,924
Reaction score
1,225
Location
Mid Michigan
If it is a factory warranty block that machined pad above the oil pan will not have any stampings. But there will be a blue tag riveted to the side of the block.
 

Chryslerdude

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2017
Messages
76
Reaction score
50
Location
North Sealand - Denmark
Not every block gets a VIN. I've heard this reported more than once. I can't say I've looked on every block I've come across, but when I looked, it's always been there.

The stamped number on the block can be hidden behind engine paint. You're looking for a flat machined area just above or touching the oil pan rail. On the passenger side. It's about 2-inches long and 1/2-inch high. The surface faces outward, perpendicular to the ground.

If you don't see a flat machined area, in the middle of the oil pan, on the passenger side, adjacent to and/or touching the oil pan, I don't think you want to bother removing any paint.

If your engine is missing it's VIN number, I may just call it original, but without documented proof. I'm not sure anyone will really care. This isn't one of those ultra rare Hemicudas. She sure is pretty, though.

Two images, one with VIN one without.





There is a partial VIN on the transmission, too.
Thank you very much :), both for the educational pictures, and for the kind words abt my GP.. It is really pretty.. (especially that night)! I think it was showing it's gratitude by looking so good, as I adjusted the kick down lever earlier, that same day.. ha ha!

IMG_6184.jpg
 

Chryslerdude

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2017
Messages
76
Reaction score
50
Location
North Sealand - Denmark
If it is a factory warranty block that machined pad above the oil pan will not have any stampings. But there will be a blue tag riveted to the side of the block.
Thank you Lee.. Interesting with the blue tag.. Is anything stamped on those riveted tags? I don't recall seeing any, but might very well havd looked in the wrong spot on the block..! I work so much, that I forget a lot of things, but will get pictures when it stops raining every day, all day.. 🌨️ 🤨
 

moparlee

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2011
Messages
2,924
Reaction score
1,225
Location
Mid Michigan
Thank you Lee.. Interesting with the blue tag.. Is anything stamped on those riveted tags? I don't recall seeing any, but might very well havd looked in the wrong spot on the block..! I work so much, that I forget a lot of things, but will get pictures when it stops raining every day, all day.. 🌨️ 🤨
Here are the two tags which were riveted to the side of my warranty block.
tag.jpg
 

MoparCarGuy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2020
Messages
505
Reaction score
388
WARRANTY BLOCKS AND TAGS:
Pic 1: Engine Instruction Sheet with NOTE to dealership that warranty blocks are "supplied only with blank engine number pad" but the "Dealers are governed by their state law on the application of engine numbers in the field."
So warranty blocks will be found both with and without VINs stamped on their engine number pads.
Pic 2: Example blank warranty tag in blue for 1969-1974 warranty blocks.
Pic 3: Location of a riveted warranty tag.
Pic 4: Actual warranty engine block showing a blank engine number pad.
Pic 5: Details on Warranty Engines and Tags

zzzwarrantypaper2 saying to Stamp the Warranty Block as per State Law.jpg
Warranty Block Tag.jpg
Warranty Block Tag 2.jpg
Blank Warranty Engine VIN Pad.jpg

RB Warranty Service Block Tags Guide.jpg
 

Chryslerdude

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2017
Messages
76
Reaction score
50
Location
North Sealand - Denmark
WARRANTY BLOCKS AND TAGS:
Pic 1: Engine Instruction Sheet with NOTE to dealership that warranty blocks are "supplied only with blank engine number pad" but the "Dealers are governed by their state law on the application of engine numbers in the field."
So warranty blocks will be found both with and without VINs stamped on their engine number pads.
Pic 2: Example blank warranty tag in blue for 1969-1974 warranty blocks.
Pic 3: Location of a riveted warranty tag.
Pic 4: Actual warranty engine block showing a blank engine number pad.
Pic 5: Details on Warranty Engines and Tags

View attachment 110618 View attachment 110619 View attachment 110620View attachment 110621
View attachment 110625
Thanks so much, for this detailed information! This forum is amazing, and I am really happy for all your kind comments, and information! Thanks all !!
:)
 

Chryslerdude

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2017
Messages
76
Reaction score
50
Location
North Sealand - Denmark
Finally got the garage cleared, and got the Barracuda in the air, scraped of some flaky paint that was camouflaging the stamp, and was thrilled to confirm, that the car still have it´s original engine..!
Thanks again, to all of you nice E-Buddy people! 🥰
 

Chryslerdude

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2017
Messages
76
Reaction score
50
Location
North Sealand - Denmark
Did you happen to check the stamp on the transmission while you had the car in the air? Was it original?
Happen to take any pictures?

To be honest.. I only had time to clear enough free floor space, to roll in the 70' and jack it up on a floor jack, but will definitely check the trans when I get the lift free.. but I did get pictures.. will post ASAP.. :)
 
Back
Top